Jul1
Kiznaiver Series Review
Time to talk Kiznaiver!
Sorry for the delay on getting this out, but I recently got my Youtube account back after getting a copyright strike which takes your channel down for at least six or so months! Anyway I’m taking a new approach to my reviews by combining my drawings and audio together! I hope you enjoy watching me draw while talking about Kiznaiver.
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Extra Kiznaiver
Agata could make a living as a crash test dummy.
Best face ever.
Niko-“Ehhhhhhh zombies!? Why did it have to be zombies?!”
Dat brain freeze…
Gotta love that Space Dandy hair <3
Finished drawing
Yay swimsuits! Woooooo!!
About Foshizzel
Is huge anime fan from Florida! who loves to watch anime and also enjoys drawing and collecting pictures, my favorite genre of anime has to be Mecha, there is just something awesome about giant robots beating the crap out of each other! Other than that type of show, I love a good comedy or action series :D
POWUH: and LOLi Defender with 10998 comments
Ah, Kizu! My favorite new Niko delivery system. Get it? I like Nico from Love Live and I quit smoking seven months ago?
This thing on….? Anyway. It really was a Niko delivery system for us, right Fosh, as that was our favorite character. And honestly, she really does deserve it doesn’t she? She one of those great Okada characters that just externalize everything!
POWUH: Meta Team and PreCure Mastah with 9203 comments
LOL gotcha!
Yeah Niko was quite the character from just being the “goofball” of Kiznaiver, but there was so much more to her and good job on Okada for doing something interesting with her.
POWUH: Meta Team and Spammy Tamer with 7115 comments
Kiznaiver was a show that took its time to get good, but it got really good. For me the real turning point in the show was when the implications of the love conga line were becoming clear, that there was a lot of people who needed to figure out how they were going to move forward. And then the next episode, 9, when they were able to hear the thoughts of the others, was just some wonderful writing. We can talk about Mari Okada’s writing, and whether she sets up melodrama, or whether it’s just good writing, but I think that the one thing she does better than anyone else is write that “love loser” character. When I think about the shows she’s most famous for, the characters who had the most compelling emotions are those ones that it just didn’t work out for. Minorin and Ami-chan, Linda-senpai, Minko, Miuna and Chisaki, Nanami Aoyama, Everyone in True Tears. All of these characters that you just felt for. And this show brought you three of them, but none more than Nico. Her excoriation of Chidori that she was going to go out there and get her heart properly broken was just wonderful, and then to hear her heart scream “If you don’t want him, why can’t you give him to me!” It’s like finally Mari Okada had the chance to make it clear what that character’s feelings were, thanks to the device of the show. And then for Nico to have that broken heart and still want to be friends with everyone, even being the catalyst for them to still be trying, she really was a wonderful character, a great use of the supporting character.
I kind of wish that Katsuhira and Chidori and Nori were better characters to be able to keep up with Nico, Honoka, and Tenga, but you can’t have everything.
POWUH: and LOLi Defender with 10998 comments
You know, sometimes I think when you push those first three out there and let them shine with all the polish you can give them, the other three can coast a bit, right? I mean a show just wrapped up where I wouldn’t give you a nickle for the entire cast, and this one runs great at %50? I’ll take that bargain!
This is one of those great ideas, the kizu device. Cause you struggle with character that’s cannot express themselves for whatever reason. Then you challenge that and you have a new set of obstacles for the characters to traverse.
POWUH: Meta Team and PreCure Mastah with 9203 comments
Indeed Kiznaiver was slow to start and the Kizna experiment was a bit silly, but I loved how it was used especially with episode 9! Very good stuff. Oh ya I can totally agreed with you on Okada’s writing! She does have some great “love loser” characters.
SAME I wish the other characters were better written as well; however besides Niko I gotta say that Honoka was also quite interesting like her past with her friend and her finally becoming friends with the others.
POWUH: 400-499 with 445 comments
kiznaiver had me scratching my head throughout its run. I felt it was so amateurishly written and i barely cared for any of the characters (Honoka was the only character i sort of kinda liked). Each scene was like a literary sledgehammer trying to pound its message into the viewers head over and over without any subtlety or delicacy. Ep 9 was the biggest offender of this where everything became sooooooo melodramatic and overwrought. Why did this show feel the need to explain everything that the characters were thinking or feeling? why did the dialogue feel the need to constantly repeat itself and feel stilted and forced? why cant okada evolve as a writer? why am i asking all these questions? Children shows have more deft and polish than kiznaiver….sigh….the thing is i actually wanted to like this series but i guess you cant help these things sometimes. Here’s hoping okada’s latest movie is pretty good. It looks pretty so im looking forward to it
POWUH: Meta Team and PreCure Mastah with 9203 comments
Wow total opposite of me, Skylion and Highway! I dunno maybe Kiznaiver was 2deep4u? Personally I found it to be easy I mean yeah sure there are a few bits at the beginning of the series that were confusing, but for me it was the WHY and HOW does this Kizna system work?
On the subject of Kiznaiver being “amateurishly written” I don’t really agree with that and honestly I haven’t written anything like a book or anything major and I have no idea if you have either. That said yes some of the drama is a bit forced to cause us to react or feel something, but with any of Okada’s works you kinda gotta expect there to be some drama happening between the cast of characters with whatever series she is working on. Hell some probably think Koutetsujou no Kabaneri is the best written series from spring! Do I agree? No of course not, but ah well we all have our own thoughts on what we think isn’t written well.
That was kinda the point of the series and the Kizna system it was used for that purpose…
As in? I can’t recall anything being constantly repeated? Maybe just the whole Agata can’t feel pain and forgot the past?
I don’t claim to be a Okada pro, but I’m sure Highway can correct us? Also with any writer they have hits and misses its just how it works.
POWUH: 400-499 with 445 comments
“that was kinda the point of the series and the Kizna system it was used for that purpose…”
I dont think that makes it justified tho because if that factor enhanced the storytelling, that i would wholeheartedly agree with you but in my opinion, it didnt. There are quite a few ways the series could have used the kizna system to explore the emotions of these characters without them screaming on the top of their lungs about it to explain every iota of what they were feeling (which i could have bared with if what they said was interesting or insightful) or to for katsuhira to constantly be like “i want to connect, can you see me trying to connect….i reeeeeaaally want to connect guys; we are tied to the kizna system, therefore everyone wants to connect” no shit katsu…and yes i get it, he’s a bit emotionally stunted due to his past but again, you can use that characteristic in more dynamic ways.The show felt the need to exclaim everything, and then exposit on things that you could have realized just by watching scene as well as relying on exposition dumps for certain plot threads that didnt need it like noriko’s backstory.
And by amateurishly written, im referring to how the characters dont get past being two dimensional, or how some of the thematic elements of the show get sidelined and inadequetely explored, or how the dialogue leaves a lot to be desired, or how the series composition felt a bit….on second thought the series composition was alright :).
The show pretends to understand human psychology and yet it comments on it in the most uninspired of ways. And then there’s noriko, which the show tries so hard to make a tragic figure that hell, even the show goes a bit meta when nico is all like “i dont care how much of a tragic character you are”. Noriko stays in the background for most of the series that she feels more like a plot device than a character. I dont know man, kiznaiver felt like it was trying to hard for me. I understand im in the minority when it comes to kizna and im glad people felt some emotional connection with this series but i didnt. It just goes to show how different people’s viewpoints can be. Even toradora, while i feel it got overdramatic here and there (though it didnt take it too far thank god), that show did a tremendously better job at exploring the emotional growth of these group of adolescent kids, who you could argue were outcasts and it did it with much more care.
I guess by the end of this series what bothered me the most was realizing that okada has become stagnant; that’s the big takeaway for me…mayoigaa and this show wore on me. Kiznaiver isnt shit by any means whatsoever, but it’s lost potential, lacking in creative and emotional integrity, and that’s more disappointing in my opinion when a show has potential and fails to grab it. Ps. kabaneri’s writing is mediocre 🙂 we definitely agree on that
POWUH: Meta Team and Spammy Tamer with 7115 comments
I think you’re being a little facile about emotions. A lot of times, they are screaming at the top of their metaphorical lungs, and especially if you have a situation where only the highest signal-to-noise ratio is going to get through, then the strongest, most straightforward emotions are going to be the ones that the others hear. That’s why we really didn’t get much of Honoka’s or Yuta’s emotions coming through, because they were actually on the OTP path from the beginning, and the big stuff didn’t really effect them.
So to me it was completely understandable that there was very little nuance there at the climax of the series. They are high school kids who are in love and hurting, and it was a very short sharp shock kind of thing. A show like Toradora, besides having fewer main characters and twice as many episodes, took a year of time for the characters, which allowed the characters to develop that kind of nuanced emotion. I think bringing that in here would have felt inauthentic, at least in regards to Chidori, Tenga, and Nico. And to the contrary, I thought that Honoka and Yuta were quite a bit more ‘deep’ as far as characters, they just weren’t the main characters.
Don’t blame Okada too much for Mayoiga, because she didn’t write the script. And I think that it’s a tough path to walk, you talking about becoming stagnant. Mari Okada is good at quite a lot of story types, but people want to see what she’s known for. If she goes too far outside of that, you get complaining. But you revisit the same themes, and some people are going to think that it’s the same as Nagi no Asukara, or Toradora, or Golden Time, or Hanasaku Iroha. And no, I don’t think those shows are the same, but there are some things that are similar.
And you’re too nice to Kabaneri. Its writing is bad. not mediocre. Hundred‘s writing is mediocre. Kabeneri is bad.
POWUH: Meta Team and Spammy Tamer with 7115 comments
Oh, one other thing that occurred to me, regarding Nori being a tragic figure. She certainly is, but to me, that was kind of a misdirection, and an obvious setup. And even Katsuhira was a misdirection. To me, the main characters were Chidori, Tenga, and Nico, and their interaction with Katsuhira was the driver of the show. Unfortunately, Katsuhira and Nori were supposed to be the main characters, so that may be a bit of a fail, but I thought it was fine looking at the others.
POWUH: and LOLi Defender with 10998 comments
If you didn’t see both Nori and Katsu as bookends and and thematic characters then you missed the whole point of the show….
POWUH: 400-499 with 445 comments
haha i knew you’d use the length of toradora as a defense for kizna but you know what, i dont even think that works as a defense because eight eps into toradora and those characters were much more fleshed out than kizna’s characters ever got. But i guess i can see where you’re coming from that toradora was a different animal….eh…i guess we’ll have to agree to disagree although you’re lens is definitely interesting. And yes, i was being a bit nicer to kabaneri than id like to admit.
POWUH: and LOLi Defender with 10998 comments
I think you might have a certain squishy nostalgia informing your there. I wouldn’t say any of those characters were fleshed out under that span off time. Far from it? No, but certainly not any more than Kinza’s were/are.
Well, Toradora, Pet Girl, Golden Time. The first two were her script’s and series comp based on someone else’s property, and Highway can correct me, but GT was just her series comp credit…So I would always count them as a different animal from her original properties, IE. Lull and Kinza. The devil will come out in the details.
As for Kabaneri. Dog pile that thing. It’s OK to call a shameful franchise grab out for what it was….
POWUH: Meta Team and Spammy Tamer with 7115 comments
I’d agree with skylion about Toradora, because it’s impossible to go back and watch it without knowing about the characters through the end. By eight episodes, there were really only 2 characters in Toradora, as Ami, Minori, and Kitamura were really just objects at that point, starting to be main characters. So if Ryuuji and Taiga were more developed at that point it’s because they were the focus.
I was wrong about Golden Time, that wasn’t Mari Okada at all. And Sakurasou was just series comp. But there’s a lot of stuff that you wouldn’t think would be there as script, like Gundam Orphans (although I contend she had too much Gundam stuff to deal with there for it to be very interesting) and WIXOSS, which I found pretty good (even if skylion got tired of blogging it at some points).
In the end, I thought that Kiznaiver was a pretty compelling show, and it really snuck up on me at that. I wasn’t too into it in the beginning, and then by like episode 5 I was thinking “this is really good…”
POWUH: 400-499 with 445 comments
i just recently rewatched toradora so i dont think nostalgia is clouding my memory although ill admit there was a bit of hyperbole in my statement saying that they were more fleshed out; flesh out=/= more interesting. However, im not joking when i say that in 8 eps, there was more nuance to toradora’s cast than in kizna. Just because we didnt get a deep background into all the characters doesnt mean the nuance wasnt there and this is what im trying to get at. In toradora, the characters had more facets to their personalities and the show gradually revealed bits and pieces of those nuances for the viewer to piece together by the time the 8th/9th ep came around. There was intrigue with ryuuga and taiga (obviously), i started to see through minori’s facade, and ami’s conflict with who she presents to people and who she truly wants to be became more dynamic. All of this was possible because the writing was better in toradora. So yea, i stand by my claim that the cast of toradora was much more interesting by the 8th/9th ep than the entire kizna cast
POWUH: and LOLi Defender with 10998 comments
Well, can we give Trigger at least some credit for getting some nuance in Kizna? I mean, they tried really hard to make this not the run of the mill of their very checkered and crazed legacy.
POWUH: 400-499 with 445 comments
sigh…alright fine XD
POWUH: Meta Team and Spammy Tamer with 7115 comments
Hmm, I think that was the entire point of the series. By using the Kizuna system, they were able have a way to communicate things in the show that usually the characters are guessing about.
How many shows have we seen where the characters just refuse to pick up on what the other characters are thinking or feeling? We accept that, even when the reasons they don’t share information are stupid, because we understand that people can’t always understand what other people are thinking. And sometimes we get frustrated when they don’t pick up such OBVIOUS signals, but that’s more hubris on our parts than anything else, because as a human, you’ve missed a ton of signals and intentions.
So from this usual filter of having to read the atmosphere and other people, these kids are forced into hearing what the other people are feeling, and ultimately thinking. And then that’s taken away. I thought that it was used to very good effect, especially with Chidori’s heart crying out in episode 9 for Katsuhira to hold her, and then condemning him as awful for doing it, which is exactly what he was. Because even with that connection, he didn’t understand that she wanted him to hold her *instead* of Nori, she wanted him to hold her with more meaning than Nori, and it just didn’t happen.
Personally, I think Okada works on more levels. I think there is subtlety and delicacy, it’s just around and behind and underneath the obvious drama. But there’s also another factor here, that the show was made by Trigger, and if we think that Okada is subtle as a sledgehammer, Trigger outdoes her on that lack of subtlety by a factor of a gazillion. There is nothing subtle, ever, about Trigger, and with a first time director in Hiroshi Kobayashi, I really felt that the whole package came together really well about halfway through the series, and stayed very nice through the remainder.